truepenny: artist's rendering of Sidneyia inexpectans (btvs: buffyfaith-poisoninjest)
Sarah/Katherine ([personal profile] truepenny) wrote2006-12-19 08:05 am
Entry tags:

Let's talk about sex.

ETA: since [livejournal.com profile] metafandom has apparently linked to this post sans context, let me state explicitly that I'm talking about the MISLABELING of original fiction featuring a same-sex relationship--as for example, [livejournal.com profile] matociquala's Carnival--as slash in reviews and commentary by people who are not slash writers themselves. I'm not trying to talk about what slash writers choose to do within their fandoms and communities. Not a slasher. Don't play one on TV. I'm arguing that slash, as a term, belongs to fanfiction, and should not be applied to works that are not fanfiction. My reasons for feeling as I do, explained in the following post, stem partly from my own career as a pro writer whose work features a lot of same-sex relationships, and partly from my appreciation, as a genre theorist, of the intertextual subversion inherent in what slash does.

The subtext, as Giles says to Buffy in "Ted," is rapidly becoming text.

hth




More specifically, let's talk about slash and why it is offensive and heteronormatizing to equate it with homosexual relationships.

The subversion/containment model (proposed by Foucault and applied by a bunch of New Historicist critics in the 1980s) has buried somewhere in the unexamined assumptions of its premise the notion that somehow subversion is bad. Or nonsustainable. Conservation of energy. A society tends to conserve the status quo.

This may be descriptively true (she says, looking dourly at her own society), but prescriptively, it sucks major moose cock, because it assumes that subversion exists to be contained. Hence Natalie Zemon Davis's elaboration of Foucault with her "pressure-valve" idea. (Which, btw, I think is incredibly helpful for understanding extremely conservative societies--like I said, descriptively the idea can be very helpful.)

Slash is subversion.

(For those of you who are still wondering what on earth I'm talking about, slash is a kind of fanfiction which posits a romantic/sexual relationship between two characters who in canon have no such thing. You might also describe it as an underground movement. It's named for the labelling convention that marks it; the first slash was K/S: Kirk-slash-Spock.)

Slash says, "These two canonically romantically-uninvolved characters have a close, intense, and obviously loving relationship. Our society--as inscribed on these characters by censorship and other kinds of normatizing pressure--does not allow that relationship to be developed in a sexual way. Let's transgress the taboo."

Now, obviously, that transgression can be done mindfully or otherwise, but the key component to slash is the overt sexualization of a non-sexual, or only subtextually sexual, relationship.

That relationship is, 9 times out of 10, between two men. Because, 9 times out of 10, the most intense and interesting relationship in any given canon is--wait for it--between two men. (And that has to do with a whole bunch of other factors and influences including, you know, four or five millennia worth of patriarchy.)

Now, why am I so adamant that slash is not the same as homosexual relationships?

Because I insist that homosexual relationships ought not to be categorized as subversive.

(Okay, yes, leftist liberal commie bitch, that would be me. Please don't tell me you're surprised.)

Labelling a homosexual relationship in a work of fiction as slash is wrong for a couple of reasons. One is that it's eliding the line between a work of fiction and commentary ON that work of fiction. I think it's inherent to slash that it is subverting and deconstructing and undercutting a canon text's assumptions about sexuality and love (using "text" here in a broad and metaphorical sense, rather than the literal one of words-printed-on-a-page). Slash is a game played with canon, and part of its value is in the tension it both creates and illuminates between canon text and subtext.

The other reason that it's wrong to label homosexual relationships, whether in or out of fiction, as slash is that it is reinscribing heteronormativity on our society and our discourse. It's a syllogism. Slash is gay sex. Slash is subversive. Therefore, gay sex is subversive. The subversion/containment model is a BOX, and as long as we keep putting homosexual relationships in that box, we are reinforcing the idea that heterosexuality is the standard by which all other sexualities will and ought to be judged. The same idea that is powering the (often hysterical) attempts to define marriage in such a way that gay and lesbian people cannot have it. Because their committed monogamous relationships are being judged as subversive.

And that's so horribly wrong that it's eaten all my words.

[identity profile] bunney.livejournal.com 2006-12-21 03:49 pm (UTC)(link)
Hmmmm, maybe. Terminology changes over time, however, so while in the misty beginnings of fanfic, slash = non-canon relationships, that is not what it is generally accepted to mean *now*. I'm in HP fandom, so by your definition, Draco/Hermione, Harry/Hermione, Dumbledore/McGonagall, Remus/Sirius are *all* slash pairings. For that matter, Ron/Hermione would fall under the same definition, despite the fact that they are likely to become a canon pairing in the future. I think if you tried that one out in this fandom, you would meet some hardcore resistance from slashers and het fans alike.

Perhaps the term "slash" has become synonymous with "gay" but I fail to see exactly what is wrong with that. It's a term that is widely recognized as defining a same-sex relationship within fanfic and I honestly don't think most fans see it as something negative. The subversiveness (or not) of the subject matter has little to do with the word describing it. You could call it "flibbertygibbet" and if the reader/writer perceives it as subversive (or not), then that's what it will mean to them.

Besides, slash is more acceptable in terms of labeling fic than calling it "gay" or "homo" as opposed to "straight" or "het".

[identity profile] matociquala.livejournal.com 2006-12-21 04:13 pm (UTC)(link)
Right, but we're not talking about fic, are we? We're talking about use of the word to describe original fiction.

[identity profile] matociquala.livejournal.com 2006-12-21 04:27 pm (UTC)(link)
Topic sentence:

"More specifically, let's talk about slash and why it is offensive and heteronormatizing to equate it with homosexual relationships."

We're talking about the false equating of slash with homosexuality in the real-world or in original fiction.

[identity profile] dartmouthtongue.livejournal.com 2006-12-21 04:47 pm (UTC)(link)
You're putting slash on one side and gay rl and original fiction on the other? o.O wtf

[identity profile] matociquala.livejournal.com 2006-12-21 04:53 pm (UTC)(link)
No, we're talking about the use of the word "slash" to describe homosexual characters in original fiction. And why it's not such a great idea.

See what happens when you wander into a conversation in the middle?

[identity profile] dartmouthtongue.livejournal.com 2006-12-21 04:54 pm (UTC)(link)
Yeah, I keep asking until somebody snarks at me, yet answers my question. ;D

[identity profile] dartmouthtongue.livejournal.com 2006-12-21 05:01 pm (UTC)(link)
Oh, yes, it was. You're snarky as fuck, and you can barely hold it in, but it's enjoyable and you're right. Calling homosexuality slash is not such a good idea, just not because of the subversive thing, but because of the focus, IMO.

[identity profile] matociquala.livejournal.com 2006-12-21 05:08 pm (UTC)(link)
*g* Nah, when I start to snark, I use footnotes.

I was probably a little more sarcastic than I needed to be, though, and I'm worry for that.

[identity profile] dartmouthtongue.livejournal.com 2006-12-21 05:20 pm (UTC)(link)
No problem. I had a little tiff a few months ago with someone, when I showed them a video of Sigur Ros (don't know if you know that band, but it rocks) and they had two teenage boys kissing. It was really a beautiful video about young love and intolerance, and their response was "Omg! I don't like so and so, but it's just sooo slashy!" It left a sour taste in my mouth, the fact that this the only response from her that garnered.


Just in case you wanna check it out:



Image




Download here: http://www.sigur-ros.co.uk/media/

(no subject)

[identity profile] matociquala.livejournal.com - 2006-12-21 17:23 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

[identity profile] matociquala.livejournal.com - 2006-12-21 17:32 (UTC) - Expand

[identity profile] bunney.livejournal.com 2006-12-21 04:32 pm (UTC)(link)
Aren't we? I followed this link from [livejournal.com profile] metafandom and wrote this comment specifically relating to this paragraph:

(For those of you who are still wondering what on earth I'm talking about, slash is a kind of fanfiction which posits a romantic/sexual relationship between two characters who in canon have no such thing. You might also describe it as an underground movement. It's named for the labelling convention that marks it; the first slash was K/S: Kirk-slash-Spock.)

So, fanfiction does have some bearing on the conversation.

[identity profile] matociquala.livejournal.com 2006-12-21 04:52 pm (UTC)(link)
That should probably be a clue that teh conversation isn't directed at people who, um, regularly write or read slash.

Also, you might consider the entire essay in context of the topic sentence.

[identity profile] bunney.livejournal.com 2006-12-21 04:55 pm (UTC)(link)
Ahh, I see. There was nothing indicated on [livejournal.com profile] metafandom that this was a conversation aimed at a select few. My apologies.

[identity profile] matociquala.livejournal.com 2006-12-21 05:06 pm (UTC)(link)
*g* It's part of a conversation that's been going on for a while. Probably a little confusing taken out of context.

Here's some backstory, from my blog....

(there's also been talk over at [livejournal.com profile] commodorified, which I think I linked all of in my posts....

http://matociquala.livejournal.com/975984.html

http://matociquala.livejournal.com/983069.html

http://matociquala.livejournal.com/983735.html

http://matociquala.livejournal.com/984007.html

http://matociquala.livejournal.com/984921.html

*g* Somebody sent a bunch of fans into a bunch of pros talking about, you know, *our* concerns. Which of course overlap with fannish concerns, but don't map directly.

Basically, we object to non-slash-fans calling our work, featuring original gay characters, "slash." For the reasons I enumerated, and the ones [livejournal.com profile] truepenny did. We don't object to slash fans enjoying our work, and we don't even in particular object to slash fans calling what we do "slashy," though it might feel a little odd.

Is that helpful?

[identity profile] dartmouthtongue.livejournal.com 2006-12-21 04:20 pm (UTC)(link)
I don't like it when people call portrayals of homosexuality slashy, because slash has always been focused on relationships and homosexual men are more than their sexual relationships. However, I don't see the problem with homosexuality being considered subversive on some level. Of course, in practice, it isn't, but neither is slash as a whole. You can say there are certain aspects of slash, just like you could of homosexuality, that are subversive, but those might be secondary effects. Homosexuality and slash may undermine heteronormativity, but it's not their reason for being, IMO.

[identity profile] dartmouthtongue.livejournal.com 2006-12-21 04:25 pm (UTC)(link)
call all portrayals of homosexuality**

[identity profile] bunney.livejournal.com 2006-12-21 04:42 pm (UTC)(link)
The argument could be made for labeling fic with a male/female dynamic as het as focusing primarily on the sexual aspect of it. I'm not a slash fan, so maybe that's why I don't see the distinction as clearly. For all intents and purposes, when I refer to a slash pairing, I'm referring to male/male or female/female, with no regards to their sexual proclivities. Same with referring to a male/female pairing as "het". It's a label that I use for the benefit of the reader, rather than my own purposes, so that they will know what they're in for when they read something I've written.

I think there is a level of subversiveness to slash fiction, if only because it does largely stray from the canon norm, not because it falls into some kind of second class gray area. And I say canon norm to indicate that homosexuality is not given equal "air time" as heterosexuality. Nothing sinister meant!

[identity profile] dartmouthtongue.livejournal.com 2006-12-21 04:52 pm (UTC)(link)
That's not what I meant. I meant that I don't like it too much when people see ANY portrayal of homosexuality and call it slashy. It's not about calling slash slash and het het, because I totally understand people using terms like that, 'cause it's totally useful and economical.

I wasn't really disagreeing with you, I was just adding on it, so, erm, whatever.

[identity profile] bunney.livejournal.com 2006-12-21 05:03 pm (UTC)(link)
Oh, not a problem! I got what you meant:) The differentiation is kind of a hot-button topic in my neck of fandom, so I think I'm going to bow out of the conversation before any more of the natives get restless.

Thanks for your insight!

[identity profile] matociquala.livejournal.com 2006-12-21 05:11 pm (UTC)(link)
Yep. Whereas our concern over here is making the differentiation between canon and non-canon sources. *g* Different hobbyhorses. So totally not our place to tell you what to do in your fandom.

[identity profile] bunney.livejournal.com 2006-12-21 05:52 pm (UTC)(link)
It would've saved us all a bit of confusion had [livejournal.com profile] metafandom not posted the link. It's extremely misleading for a link to be posted on a public fandom comm, then have it turn out to have nothing to do with a fandom at all. They don't warn for those sorts of things, you know.

*grumbles*

[identity profile] matociquala.livejournal.com 2006-12-21 06:01 pm (UTC)(link)
Hee. Well, I don't think any of us even knew there was a link until you mentioned it....

[identity profile] bunney.livejournal.com 2006-12-21 06:08 pm (UTC)(link)
Hey, leave it to me to throw a wrench into the works! Carry on!

[identity profile] truepenny.livejournal.com 2006-12-21 06:21 pm (UTC)(link)
I've posted a clarification/caveat up at the top of the entry.